If businesspeople donate, poverty ends

Businessman who donated 60% of his fortune sees a moral obligation between the rich and the poor.

Elie Horn, 74, is the only major businessman operating in Brazil who, during his lifetime, donated 60% of his fortune to charity. For him, the richest have an obligation: to donate or donate. If they complied, “poverty in Brazil would end in 10 years”. As the richest 1% of the country accumulates 49% of the wealth , according to the bank Credit Suisse, perhaps they needed much less than the thousand entrepreneurs estimated by Elie for this mission.

Born in Syria, Horn emigrated as a child, with his parents, to Brazil. His paternal grandfather sheltered orphans from the First World War. His father donated 100% of what he had. With them, Elie, one of the richest men in Brazil, learned the meaning of the verb 'to donate'.

In this interview, the Orthodox Jew answered questions about contradictions and guilt, such as having created an empire and still talking about dividing it. Despite this disposition, he does not give his opinion on political issues such as the taxation of large fortunes: “I prefer to answer next time”.

It was in 2015 that he and his wife, Susy, became the only entrepreneurs in Brazil to join the philanthropic project The Giving Pledge, founded by Bill Gates (who donated 99% of his fortune) and Warren Buffett. According to the latest Forbes magazine ranking, Elie Horn had a fortune of R$3.5 billion. “I think I do well in both roles, businessman and philanthropist”, ponders Elie. Check out the full interview below.

Did any specific case make you awaken to philanthropy?
My grandfather, who I never met, in the first world war, gave shelter to a few thousand war orphans. My father taught me the meaning of the verb give. He had little and gave 100% of what he had to charity. They did a lot for the world and I thought I couldn't be left behind.

“I wanted to give 100%, but my people didn't let me. So we made an agreement to donate 60%. The remaining 40% goes to the family to, in turn, do the same thing I did: donate money again.”

In your opinion, what would be the obligation of the richest towards the poorest?
Conscience and morals. The problem starts with another question: why do I exist? Why do I live? What is the meaning of existence and what did I come to do in the world? It is a process of mental development that leads you to conclude that the only thing that gives meaning to your existence is the good that you do or, by default, that you do not do. That's the reason for my life, and yours. The fact that you ask questions makes you understand my mission. We are all accomplices involved in the same scheme. There is no innocence. We are all guilty until proven guilty.

What is our great fault?
Not doing enough. I apologize for not having done more. I hope to make up for it in the future. Good includes philanthropy, charity. But, everyone does good in their own way.

And do we close our eyes to this good?
Closing your eyes is human essence. Someone taught me how to say no. If you say “yes” to everyone, you have lost your essence as a human being. For there to be progress, there needs to be a cut. I need to sleep to wake up the next day. We close our eyes because there is no other way. It's not me or you, but everyone.

The taxation of great fortunes is a hot debate.
Taking advantage of the fact that you talked about “closing your eyes”, do you agree or disagree? I'd rather answer you next time. It's a very big and delicate subject. I can't talk about him without being prepared.

And do you learn to be good?
Yes, everything can be learned. In my case, my father was fundamental. He was a tough, rigid, authoritarian man, but he did good. You have three souls. A good soul, a not good soul and a neutral soul. Depending on your experience, you feed one or the other. Who is the most selfish person in the world? A six-year-old child wants everything for himself, wants to receive everything and gives nothing. Receives love, but doesn't give it.

As a business owner, can you maintain this asset?
I do well in both roles, philanthropy and business.
I love working, I hate it when I get anxious when I'm free. I try to mix the good in business. On Sunday now, we held a philanthropy committee to raise money for the weakest financial brokers. Brokers will raise money, not me. It was their idea. When a broker makes money, he blows everything. When I was an executive at the company, when there was a price difference between what the buyer wanted to give and what the seller charged, the difference went to charity. Example: I sell for 100 and you want to pay me 90. I accept 90, but the extra 10 you need to donate. It's a mix of business and good.

Economically, is it interesting to do good?
Economically, spiritually… Yes, it is very important. If you have it and it doesn't work, you pay. You have to be very foolish not to choose to do good and pay for it in eternity. On a physical level, if you do good, good comes too. Not everything is intelligence, it can be blessing.

“If you donate money, you also teach your children not to be selfish. Doing good and giving money only brings positive things. Not doing good and not giving money is for people who are stupid: DUMB.”

Do you notice stupidity in businesspeople, do you know?
Laughter.
I'm not going to talk about who I know. If I don't know, I don't know. I won't talk either. But in general, I see good will. What's missing is nudging people. It's a kind of dormant thing that has to be woken up. When you wake people up, they help others. There are very good partners who donate. There was a person who knocked on my office, came here to donate and donated millions.

Did the pandemic poke?
The person at home starts to think more about life. It's wrong to have a pandemic to have to do good. We have to do good until death. Your job, as a journalist, is to inform. From today, you can have another mission, to make people donate, to make people speak well of philanthropy and wake up.

Do you think highly successful entrepreneurship is possible or just an illusion for the poor?
Illusion does not exist. Whoever wants to do it. I don't remember wanting something in life and not getting it. Of the normal things I wanted, I made it a goal, and I thought I would achieve it anyway – in normal ways.

“The word 'no' is not in my dictionary. Someone asked me about not being able to. No power does not exist. I don't want to fly and break my face. God is not fashionable, but for me he exists. He is also a partner of good.”

How did you turn your business into an empire?
I started working when I was 19, doing brokerage. Then, I started buying and selling apartments with no money. The apartment was worth 10 thousand dollars, I paid a thousand dollars and borrowed the rest. I sold the apartment to pay off the loan. I started doing this, I took out the compound interest, and I got some equity. At 29 years old, I became very well off and was perhaps one of the strongest young people in the country in terms of wealth. I took advantage of the hole that existed in the market.

“I worked 14 hours a day, six days a week. If you work 14 and someone else works eight, what's the difference? In 20 years, it's brutal. If you earn money and spend it all, you will never have money. I had no other option, either I won or I won.”

What do you think about this space that work occupies in life?
Do we waste part of our lives working? I think we lose by doing something stupid. Waste time doing and thinking nonsense. Lots of leisure, lots of drinking, lots of everything. This is harmful, it is much more harmful to use time for nonsense than for positive things. Young people have a difference, because they are discovering life and have to go through it. I think I didn't have a childhood, and I didn't have much of a youth. I regret? Not even a little. I regret wasting time on nonsense. At the age of 15, someone I know started working and built an empire at 30. But he made self-sacrifice. There is nothing without self-sacrifice.

Returning to wanting: don’t you think there are difficulties in this “wanting”?
By definition, wanting will always have difficulties. The world is purposely full of confusion. It's up to me to reverse the position. Ending Brazil's problem is very easy. If a thousand businesspeople come together to donate, poverty in Brazil will end in 10 years.

“Brazil has two problems: lack of education, which takes away people’s rights and perpetuates poverty; and, for there to be prosperity, it needs efficient management. There can be no fight between the three powers. The country's social policy cannot change. Let the rest fight as they please, but don't take from the poor. This cannot be changed, there must be strict laws. Disunity causes mismanagement.”

What is the reward?
In my case, it was earning to help. Then, earn so you don't depend. Freedom consists of whether I want to work or not. I like independence and freedom. But freedom is not chaos, it is the right to do good within options. Young man, I already did a little charity. Among my friends, I took a few cruises from my friends to give to the person in front of the school.

When did this charity take on another proportion?
I started from absolute zero. I made money in real estate. I started from scratch again, with a loan. At 38 years old, philanthropy took another place in my life. It was maturity. But there is, yes, something that I thought about a lot. At school, I took the tram and walked a kilometer to get there. On the way, there was a child on the street, with a physical disability and that shocked me. Another time, I saw a pregnant woman, with a baby, both in the rain… That shocked me again. I began to ask: “God, if you exist, how do you allow something like this?” One question led to another. At the time I saw this, I was between 12 and 17 years old.

And do you think that management today in Brazil is intelligent?
As long as there is a fight, it cannot be intelligent.